Comments on: How long is the answer accurate? http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/ Readings, insights and understanding from the I Ching, the oracle of Change. Thu, 20 Nov 2008 17:09:19 +0000 By: Steve http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-23801 Steve Sun, 19 Nov 2006 17:03:07 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-23801 Even though the invitation to ask again in hexagram 8 is an artefact of the Wilhelm translation, I find it a strangely satisfying idea and so I think it adds to the book. You are being asked to cast your lot to the wind once again, daring the oracle to support you (but only because invited to do so). It really does elicit some powerful on-the-spot introspection, effectively you are being asked a question by the oracle itelf, namely: 'Do you think you are really up to this?' If you do, you cast again, with the risk that the oracle will tell you that you are not the one, you are not as you take yourself to be. But when the oracle confirms you in your possession of 'sublimity, constancy, and perseverance' you can find yourself not merely answered but empowered. I believe one should be empowered before attempting 'holding together', so I value the idea of hexagram 8 offering an invitation to inquire again. Even though the invitation to ask again in hexagram 8 is an artefact of the Wilhelm translation, I find it a strangely satisfying idea and so I think it adds to the book. You are being asked to cast your lot to the wind once again, daring the oracle to support you (but only because invited to do so). It really does elicit some powerful on-the-spot introspection, effectively you are being asked a question by the oracle itelf, namely: ‘Do you think you are really up to this?’ If you do, you cast again, with the risk that the oracle will tell you that you are not the one, you are not as you take yourself to be. But when the oracle confirms you in your possession of ’sublimity, constancy, and perseverance’ you can find yourself not merely answered but empowered. I believe one should be empowered before attempting ‘holding together’, so I value the idea of hexagram 8 offering an invitation to inquire again.

]]> By: Hilary http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-23783 Hilary Sun, 19 Nov 2006 14:25:26 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-23783 On hexagram 8 and consulting again, see Steve's post. Re-consulting after hexagram 8 is an artefact of the translation, and there are other ways to translate. 'Retrace the consulation to its source,' for instance, suggests not consulting over again, but asking yourself 'where you're coming from' in making this divination. Doesn't Blofeld also include a table of hexagrams and the dates they're supposed to represent? Seems odd! But I would agree with the basic point that there are better things to do with the I Ching than predict timing. Also, if timing's predictable at all, then I expect there are better ways of doing it. On hexagram 8 and consulting again, see Steve’s post. Re-consulting after hexagram 8 is an artefact of the translation, and there are other ways to translate. ‘Retrace the consulation to its source,’ for instance, suggests not consulting over again, but asking yourself ‘where you’re coming from’ in making this divination.

Doesn’t Blofeld also include a table of hexagrams and the dates they’re supposed to represent? Seems odd! But I would agree with the basic point that there are better things to do with the I Ching than predict timing. Also, if timing’s predictable at all, then I expect there are better ways of doing it.

]]> By: Qiaoen http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-23782 Qiaoen Sun, 19 Nov 2006 14:19:34 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-23782 Oh, I forgot to add... in his pared-down translation of the I Ching, which was made specifically for divination of the future, John Blofeld advises us not to include any sort of specific time frame in our questions. He says that the I Ching was not intended to give time-accurate answers. His advice is to pose questions of the sort such as, "What result can I expect if I..." and the like. I believe he also said the I Ching can't answer Yes/No questions. Sorry, I don't have his book with me, so I can't give a complete explanation of his opinions. Oh, I forgot to add… in his pared-down translation of the I Ching, which was made specifically for divination of the future, John Blofeld advises us not to include any sort of specific time frame in our questions.

He says that the I Ching was not intended to give time-accurate answers. His advice is to pose questions of the sort such as, “What result can I expect if I…” and the like. I believe he also said the I Ching can’t answer Yes/No questions.

Sorry, I don’t have his book with me, so I can’t give a complete explanation of his opinions.

]]> By: Qiaoen http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-23780 Qiaoen Sun, 19 Nov 2006 14:10:49 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-23780 Hi, Hilary, You said: "Hi Nick, Good points. It does indeed depend on what you ask. Also, while there isn’t a hexagram that definitely suggests consulting again..." But what about Hexagram 8, which in Wilhelm says: "HOLDING TOGETHER brings good fortune. Inquire of the oracle once again Whether you possess sublimity, constancy, and perseverance; Then there is no blame. I've often wondered if this is telling me to immediately do another reading and why. What do you think? Hi, Hilary,

You said:

“Hi Nick,
Good points. It does indeed depend on what you ask. Also, while there isn’t a hexagram that definitely suggests consulting again…”

But what about Hexagram 8, which in Wilhelm says:

“HOLDING TOGETHER brings good fortune.
Inquire of the oracle once again
Whether you possess sublimity, constancy, and perseverance;
Then there is no blame.

I’ve often wondered if this is telling me to immediately do another reading and why. What do you think?

]]> By: Steve http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-23775 Steve Sun, 19 Nov 2006 13:17:15 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-23775 Hexagram 8 is regarded as the hexagram that invites you to ask again, but this is only because of the Wilhelm-Baynes translation. That said, I have been known to ask again when receiving hexagram 8, to useful effect, inasmuch as I don't recall the omen ever being countermanded, only strengthened. The implication is that if I am not the right person in the right situation then the oracle will be overturned by a subsequent consultation. However, this practice is only something acquired from the Wilhelm translation. Going back to answer #1 after a confusion of hexagrams sounds like a good idea, but actually you have denatured the first oracle by then. It is better to concede defeat and put the book away. By clinging to nothing, by giving up, it is more likely that some sense as to the truth of the situation may emerge from the clutter that has been made after the time has settled. If you attach yourself to the first answer you are likely to end up just prolonging the confusion or building hopes on an oracle that has been thrown away. You cannot fish hexagrams out of the bin. Reality is fluid, and the reality that has not yet come to be is so fluid as to be tenuous, for all it can set as hard as concrete in a moment. It is generally better to know when your approach to the book has been lousy and call it a day. Hexagram 8 is regarded as the hexagram that invites you to ask again, but this is only because of the Wilhelm-Baynes translation. That said, I have been known to ask again when receiving hexagram 8, to useful effect, inasmuch as I don’t recall the omen ever being countermanded, only strengthened. The implication is that if I am not the right person in the right situation then the oracle will be overturned by a subsequent consultation. However, this practice is only something acquired from the Wilhelm translation.

Going back to answer #1 after a confusion of hexagrams sounds like a good idea, but actually you have denatured the first oracle by then. It is better to concede defeat and put the book away. By clinging to nothing, by giving up, it is more likely that some sense as to the truth of the situation may emerge from the clutter that has been made after the time has settled. If you attach yourself to the first answer you are likely to end up just prolonging the confusion or building hopes on an oracle that has been thrown away. You cannot fish hexagrams out of the bin. Reality is fluid, and the reality that has not yet come to be is so fluid as to be tenuous, for all it can set as hard as concrete in a moment. It is generally better to know when your approach to the book has been lousy and call it a day.

]]> By: Hilary http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-23761 Hilary Sun, 19 Nov 2006 11:20:24 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-23761 <blockquote>"As a rule of thumb, if you enquire about something again a few days or a few hours later, then discard the oracle you received previously."</blockquote> Interesting. If I'm faced with someone who's asked the same question umpteen times and lost all connection with what the answers might mean, I tend to suggest they go back to answer #1. Hi Nick, Good points. It does indeed depend on what you ask. Also, while there isn't a hexagram that definitely suggests consulting again, there are hexagrams and lines that suggest something about how long the omen lasts. 32 can be a recurring pattern; 44 is a disruption to patterns, not conducive to long-term certainty. Asking about the next scene on TV? Interesting! I've found when I play 'prediction games' like this with the oracle, it plays right back. Like the time I asked how a tennis player would do, and it told me not for the game, as I'd intended, but for the tournament. Not a tame oracle ;)

“As a rule of thumb, if you enquire about something again a few days or a few hours later, then discard the oracle you received previously.”

Interesting. If I’m faced with someone who’s asked the same question umpteen times and lost all connection with what the answers might mean, I tend to suggest they go back to answer #1.

Hi Nick,
Good points. It does indeed depend on what you ask. Also, while there isn’t a hexagram that definitely suggests consulting again, there are hexagrams and lines that suggest something about how long the omen lasts. 32 can be a recurring pattern; 44 is a disruption to patterns, not conducive to long-term certainty.

Asking about the next scene on TV? Interesting! I’ve found when I play ‘prediction games’ like this with the oracle, it plays right back. Like the time I asked how a tennis player would do, and it told me not for the game, as I’d intended, but for the tournament. Not a tame oracle ;)

]]> By: N.Subramani http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-23726 N.Subramani Sun, 19 Nov 2006 03:58:05 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-23726 Greetings. on the timeframe for the answers,i wouldsay that it depends on what uhadaskedthe Iching. in case it is a question about marriage thenit would b till that marriage lasts or thatrelationship lasts. i also have read that there are some hex which would asku to consulti ching again on the same question. in caseur uestion is about the next scne in a telesrial the relevance may btill that episode.( believe me i hav tried) I hav also understood that i ching wants u to b changing and improving in life to have great fortune (enlightenment in my opinion) therefore one shouldkeep changing the course as guided and in such situation the time frame forvalidity of anser is eternal Greetings.

on the timeframe for the answers,i wouldsay that it depends on what uhadaskedthe Iching.

in case it is a question about marriage thenit would b till that marriage lasts or thatrelationship lasts.

i also have read that there are some hex which would asku to consulti ching again on the same question.

in caseur uestion is about the next scne in a telesrial the relevance may btill that episode.( believe me i hav tried)

I hav also understood that i ching wants u to b changing and improving in life to have great fortune (enlightenment in my opinion) therefore one shouldkeep changing the course as guided and in such situation the time frame forvalidity of anser is eternal

]]> By: Steve http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-23519 Steve Sat, 18 Nov 2006 05:57:29 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-23519 I wouldn't have thought there was anything surprising about the idea that we create our reality with our thoughts. You don't even have to consider the magical dimension of this to realise it has to be true. The same situation can look very different, for example, depending on what kind of mood we are in when we look at it. That is an instant effect of our thoughts. Meanwhile the situation itself is what it is. But our response to it from a happy optimistic mood could be very different to our response to it from a depressed and fearful mood. I always find it instructive how a situation can appear to change as a result of a change of mood, even though nothing has actually happened and nothing has been added to the situation beyond a more expansive outlook on it. And, as I say, this is what is perfectly obvious without even getting into the magical aspect of creating our reality. I wouldn’t have thought there was anything surprising about the idea that we create our reality with our thoughts. You don’t even have to consider the magical dimension of this to realise it has to be true. The same situation can look very different, for example, depending on what kind of mood we are in when we look at it. That is an instant effect of our thoughts. Meanwhile the situation itself is what it is. But our response to it from a happy optimistic mood could be very different to our response to it from a depressed and fearful mood. I always find it instructive how a situation can appear to change as a result of a change of mood, even though nothing has actually happened and nothing has been added to the situation beyond a more expansive outlook on it. And, as I say, this is what is perfectly obvious without even getting into the magical aspect of creating our reality.

]]> By: dobro http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-23364 dobro Fri, 17 Nov 2006 19:48:07 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-23364 "It’s probably worth saying that the I Ching’s advice is valid until in impatience you enquire again about the same thing. Omens are easily overturned by our own doubt. If you enquire again you are creating competing omens and somewhere along the line of repeated questioning the omens may distinctly change." Yeah, although I'd never have said this, I think it's probably true. You realize, of course, that the implication of all this is that we create our reality with our thoughts? If you can overturn an omen with your doubts, and if omens reflect your reality, then it means you're overturning your own reality with your doubts. “It’s probably worth saying that the I Ching’s advice is valid until in impatience you enquire again about the same thing. Omens are easily overturned by our own doubt. If you enquire again you are creating competing omens and somewhere along the line of repeated questioning the omens may distinctly change.”

Yeah, although I’d never have said this, I think it’s probably true. You realize, of course, that the implication of all this is that we create our reality with our thoughts? If you can overturn an omen with your doubts, and if omens reflect your reality, then it means you’re overturning your own reality with your doubts.

]]> By: Steve http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2006/11/15/how-long-is-the-answer-accurate/#comment-22944 Steve Thu, 16 Nov 2006 17:58:48 +0000 http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/?p=347#comment-22944 It's probably worth saying that the I Ching's advice is valid until in impatience you enquire again about the same thing. Omens are easily overturned by our own doubt. If you enquire again you are creating competing omens and somewhere along the line of repeated questioning the omens may distinctly change. I think many have probably experienced the point at which a series of good omens turned into a series of bad omens. Clearly you have cast yourself adrift by that point, and invalidated by your own actions your initial good oracle. In other words, how long an oracle is valid for is entirely dependent on you. It could be invalidated immediately if you are unable to follow it. As a rule of thumb, if you enquire about something again a few days or a few hours later, then discard the oracle you received previously. You cannot beat a situation where you may not have consulted the I Ching for, say, 3 months or more, then something important looms on your horizon, you consult the Changes about it, act on what it says, and then don't consult it again for ages. That isolated oracle has great power, and is likely to be understood lucidly. I tend to find great masses of paper with hexagrams drawn everywhere a testament only to the confusion I have allowed myself to indulge. It’s probably worth saying that the I Ching’s advice is valid until in impatience you enquire again about the same thing. Omens are easily overturned by our own doubt. If you enquire again you are creating competing omens and somewhere along the line of repeated questioning the omens may distinctly change.

I think many have probably experienced the point at which a series of good omens turned into a series of bad omens. Clearly you have cast yourself adrift by that point, and invalidated by your own actions your initial good oracle. In other words, how long an oracle is valid for is entirely dependent on you. It could be invalidated immediately if you are unable to follow it. As a rule of thumb, if you enquire about something again a few days or a few hours later, then discard the oracle you received previously.

You cannot beat a situation where you may not have consulted the I Ching for, say, 3 months or more, then something important looms on your horizon, you consult the Changes about it, act on what it says, and then don’t consult it again for ages. That isolated oracle has great power, and is likely to be understood lucidly. I tend to find great masses of paper with hexagrams drawn everywhere a testament only to the confusion I have allowed myself to indulge.

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