Comments on: Future hexagrams

By: Hilary

Hilary — Sat, 19 Jan 2008 18:21:33 +0000

Hmm… it seems quite a few people who develop a relationship with Yi over some years start seeing the second hexagram in this kind of light. (Not everyone, of course – but many.)

‘Relating hexagram’ often describes it well, but not always. Sometimes it’s the primary hexagram that reflects the immediate emotional experience and the second one is a way through. But it does very often seem to have that ‘engine’ quality about it – maybe especially when the first hexagram is something like 39 or 12, and the second hexagram provides impetus to shift the situation.

Thank you for your thoughts, and for re-awakening one of my favourite discussions.

By: proserpine

proserpine — Thu, 17 Jan 2008 07:29:20 +0000

Btw I agree that the second hexagram is like an engine pulling us or pushing us forward to an end that we have wished for or envisioned, or at least, underneath our articulated question–we already have at least the rudiments of the answer.
yes!:-)
Like you said–well put, it’s we who are pushing us towards us.

By: proserpine

proserpine — Thu, 17 Jan 2008 07:22:40 +0000

I agreee form expereince with Lyle, that the 2nd Hexagram is not necessarily a future, or at least not a staitic futre.It is an indication, an abstract of how we will be likely to be feel, or expereince if the current condtions continue as is.It is subjective of couse, as it is we who are asking or consulting the I.
However, what Jocelyne says is also very true!Like anything else, we can be worrying aboout a abstract or philossophical isue, an emtional issue or an actual here and nbow physically manifesting problem or matter.Like with Jocelyne’s dog–:-)she was accurately informed of the probem of her Wanderere dog and her answer was about Progess, because finally he stopped Wandering , and as we kno wnow, someone clearly helped dog to eat or get out of the weather or whatever, and Progress informed that J should not worry, but keep following what she was already doing–waiting for dog to return.
It *is* true that with deeper issues of our psyches the answers would necessarily not be as clear cut.
And as Lyle was saying–what is within us* already* (psychologicaly, emotionally,intellectually, talents and deeply ingrained even twisted psychological defenses and consequent illusions- even entire lifestyles) *can* change, but the “future” is usually not as sure as that dog was very likely coming home.
it’s true, that in time we mightn’t ask the I Ching much at all, as we may no longer have questions of inner struggle and self-doubts we do in very difficult and changing times.
And, as was said by Luis Andrade, the I Ching was not consulted by everyone originally–for one thing not everyone could read.
Orginally yes it was for heads of state/royalty and matters of battle.
But we are all in our own matters of battle, in our lives at some time, and as you know, just as we are comfortable in our rocking chairs we grow or are forced to face yet another challenge.
In time we do make the I’s philosophy our own.I know I have.
But I did’nt learn it or embrace it overnight.
I started with asking about a 16 yr old’s questions of my angst, love life, and misery at home with parents who never understood me.
And, as such, I understood only what little I could understand and (very luckily for me) intuit on my own.
But intuitive or not , I was still 16.;-)

By: Glenroy Wolfsen

Glenroy Wolfsen — Sat, 01 Dec 2007 22:42:15 +0000

All of these comments are very interesting. One consideration I have had in this is the considering of the moving lines. In these I see the ethics (if you will) of the situation, where they ask for motion/stillness, involvement/retreat, appropriate/inapproptiate – i.e., asking us to willingly conform to the “Dao” of the motion of this changing time by molding our will and action into that which the lines entail. This is often going very much against the grain of our habits, preferences, wish-fulfillments, etc. AND: in this – I take it that the “Future” hexgram (whether it is temporally future, or potential opening of the Self) depends on one’s willing choic(es) as the lines suggest.

By: Jocelyne

Jocelyne — Tue, 21 Nov 2006 05:37:17 +0000

Future: Definitely not generally the second hexagram wich I consider to be the “context”. In grammatical terms, it would be your circumstantial complement, including consequences and in this case the future. Not sure it makes sense for a non French speaking person, if not I apologize.

Reading however can give you the future. In case of a lost dog we had 56 the wanderer including line 4 and the next hex was 35. We found the dog 2 days later well cared for.

In a legal battle that I have with my previous employer, I go for months without a significant reading. Then, I would get 40 or 11 or something like that and it always means that something is about to happen and does happen. So I always know when something is in the pipeline and my lawyer finds it very uncanny, that I always phone him when he has news. Today I got 41 line 3 and 6 and 11. Within a day or 2 I will hear from them. But it is future in the making.

Once I had a reading for the distant future I knew it would be very long term and It was, but that is exceptionnal. It was predicting a crisis that would last for years,but that at the end, I would be reunited with my friends. Can’t remember the hexagram, but I remember the warning. The end is now very close.

By: Hilary

Hilary — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 12:10:38 +0000

Thanks, Nick. I’m all in favour of anything that gets hexagrams out of the ‘head’ and into the body.

Lyle – beautiful post, thank you. Seeing exactly what the relating hexagram is doing in any reading is an art – but the key is, exactly as you say, to recognise that it’s present.

By: N.Subramani

N.Subramani — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 03:45:49 +0000

Greetings.iwouldonly elabrate the word pushing upward.
in order for a person to move out into worldly activity one should get out of bed,reconnect to the earth
and let the earth energy be moved into the body upwards.

this can b done by standing on the earth and stretching hands uptoheaven and get reconnected.try this.u will jump with energy.
thanks

By: Lyle

Lyle — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 01:58:43 +0000

After reading this post regarding the meaning of relating hexagrams, I took another look at several personal readings I had done over the last two months. For years, I simply assumed that the progression from initial hexagram judgment and image through changing lines to resulting hexagram was a temporal passage such that the second hexagram was the final – or future – state of an unfolding present. But I was struck by a much deeper resonant truth when I applied this new perspective while contemplating the relating hexagrams of these past several readings. Rather than try to hold some idea of an extended future, I saw that the importance of the relating hexagram lies in its position of subjective awareness, or, Selfhood, within the current outward, objective situation described by the initial hexagram. While the initial hexagram describes what’s going on around us – and to us – the second relating hexagram is our Self’s own mystery stepping forward, called out to meet the situation. As such, the relating hexagram is not about some far-off future, but about a very potent, and potentially powerful, part of the present situation. It awakens the subconscious parts of our nature to the catalyst of events, teaching us how we need to grow. Thank you Stephen Karcher, and Hilary for bringing this to my attention.

By: Luis Andrade

Luis Andrade — Thu, 09 Nov 2006 15:59:21 +0000

Funny, I was typing my comment while Steve posted his. Yup, pretty much it.

By: Luis Andrade

Luis Andrade — Thu, 09 Nov 2006 15:57:01 +0000

I can’t but smile at Steve’s approach to the use of the Yi on a personal level. Of course, such an approach would put you, Hilary and others, out of the consulting business, but for a personal path, I share Steve’s view. I’ve read somewhere that the basis of the “Book of Changes”, and why it was favored in ancient dynastic courts, was to avoid just that, “Change”. A tool to find a way to “stay the course”, something very important in politics, ancient and present. Outside of politics and “big picture” schemes, and in personal relationships in particular, what’s precisely the point of “staying a course” that doesn’t seem or feel right? What’s the usefulness of questioning other’s feelings when on a practical level they either exist or they don’t and, pardon the redundancy, should be “felt”, outside of any intellectual analysis?